X Freaks Forum
The band => The Members => hide => Topic started by: LemonedNeko on September 05, 2010, 11:50:18 AM
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I was thinking about buying a bottle of saké to toast hide with on his birthday... so basically I began wondering if anyone knows what kind (brand) of saké (or other) he liked to drink?
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I'm not sure. According to the popular video which depicts how Hide reacts when given certain alcohol he seems to indicate that Red wine makes him sleep, Bourbon (his noted favourite) makes him wild and aggressive and Nihonshu (sake) makes him polite and a sharing drunk.
So if you're gonna go Nihonshu, maybe try and buy something reletively athentic (actually made in Japan). The majority of sake sold in supermarkets around here is this Choya Sake crap which tastes more akin to pure gasoline than actual drinkable alcohol.
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Mmm, I've seen it. ;)
They don't sell saké at the supermarket here, you have to buy it at "Systemet", at which case I'm assuming that I'd have to import either way since the kind that's accually made in Japan is really uncommon for some reason (the majority is from Germany, France and US). So I was thinking that since I'd have to import it either way, then perhaps one should go with his favorite brand, if there is such a thing.
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most restaurants around seem to serve either Gekeikan or Hakutsuru. Both are 'ok' but really nothing that special. I've tried a bunch of different kinds, and there's a brand called "Bishonen" which is very nice tasting and not too expensive, that's probably my favorite...don't drink anymore, though.
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there's a brand called "Bishonen"
So you drank "beautiful boy" lol does sound like brand hide would like
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yup, bishonen ;) not only that, there's a brand called "hitorimusume" (only daughter) lol
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hide drank himself to death. Just a thought.
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This just reminded me of something. I know a lot of you on these boards are sensitive when it comes to this but it's another insight into hide's death. Here's the little story...
When my friends and I were at the Toronto show @ Massey Hall we started talking to this asian guy (not even sure how) at the end of the show when crowds of us were waiting for the band to come out. He was shocked at how many white people were there (including us) and how he likes the fact they are reaching out to a wider audience etc. My friend Scott was wearing a lot of pink and had his 3 hide dolls with him for the show and the guy told us something really interesting at that point. Apparently, there is a doctor here in Toronto who works at Sick Kids Hospital who was an intern in Japan and was part of the team who received hide's body that fateful morning. The guy we talked to said he met her randomly and when he found out about this, he sold her a ticket for the Toronto show and she began to tell him more about hide. Apparently, according to this medical doctor, hide did NOT commit suicide. He died due to over-consumption of alcohol and a 3inch open gash in his head/fractured skull, loss of blood. From what he was told, she said he was WAY past the limit for consumption...basically bleeding alcohol...This was what she told him and what he told me...as for this woman's name, he can't say..however, it's such a whirlwind of emotions and things to think about that I'm not sure what to believe.
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Woah, this is major, how come they've never reported this?
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Why on earth would they try to disguise this as a suicide?! Makes no sense.
EDIT: Assuming that this is true, of course.
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Maybe they thought this looked somehow better or more interesting or whatever (to the media) than if he drank himself to death...?
I don't know, I have the impression that Japanese still have a different point of view when it comes to suicide.
I'm not sure what to believe either, but well, we'll never find ot either I'm afraid.
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To me, suicide is much worst, because I'm thinking "Aren't rock stars sort of expected to drink themselves to death?"... I'm also thinking, wouldn't they know impressionable fans would try to copy him? But I wouldn't be surprised if you were right about different point of view, considering how historically suicide is the brave thing to do, while drinking yourself to death might sound anything but glorious.
What bothers me more is the fact that they said he died of alcohol consumption but barely mentioned he had a 3 inch hole in his head? I mean, what would have caused that? You normally don't get a 3 inch hole in your skull even from hitting your head on stuff. Why wasn't that explained?
Having met a fair amount of compulsive liars who like to make up really elaborate stories to be interesting, I have my doubts. Not saying that the man Feudal met or the doctor was one, but I am less inclined to believe that sort of stories as I was once, let's say.
Also, I think we'll never know what really happened to hide, and that he's gone, and that we should all concentrate on the part where he was alive:D I remember "celebrating" hide's 2nd death anniversary and so on until I finished high school. Now that I look back, it was stupid. LemonedNeko, you're doing the right thing in celebrating his birthday.
Thanks for posting this though, Feudal. It does give a new point of view. I would have been so shocked in your place. Hope it didn't ruin your night or anything!
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First of all, if it was the actual doctor and he actually told ANYONE about the details of death and it in any way differed from the autopsy report, he should IMMEDIATELY lose his license.
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LOL it's funny 'cause if we assume that this is true it goes like this:
hide drank himself to death----> OH NOES this is not right he commitied suicide---->ZOMFG NO this is not right either, it's an accident----->OMFG......maybe he was MURDERED?
...hehe, I guess we will never know guys, it seems that there are many sources who can add or remove information about this case.
I guess, since we are mortals, we will all find out once we meet him up there.....I hope he doesn't say something like "Oops, I was drunk, I can't remember" though :P
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The guy we talked to said he met her randomly and when he found out about this, he sold her a ticket for the Toronto show and she began to tell him more about hide. Apparently, according to this medical doctor, hide did NOT commit suicide. He died due to over-consumption of alcohol and a 3inch open gash in his head/fractured skull, loss of blood. From what he was told, she said he was WAY past the limit for consumption...basically bleeding alcohol...This was what she told him and what he told me...as for this woman's name, he can't say..however, it's such a whirlwind of emotions and things to think about that I'm not sure what to believe.
Feudal, this man told me that too.
Whatever happened, we will never know. The result stays the same: hide is dead.
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It's interesting isn't it? To be honest, I'd like to accept it but unless you knew more about this doctor from Sick Kids, her name and actually talked to her, then we'll never really know. It does make me feel a bit better because I've strongly felt that hide did not kill himself and that it was a tragedy/accident. All in all, it made my night at the concert just that much more unbelievable. If anyone is interesting in contacting this guy, his name is Howard and his twitter is... twitter.com/tenrikyotoronto
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It's interesting isn't it? To be honest, I'd like to accept it but unless you knew more about this doctor from Sick Kids, her name and actually talked to her, then we'll never really know. It does make me feel a bit better because I've strongly felt that hide did not kill himself and that it was a tragedy/accident. All in all, it made my night at the concert just that much more unbelievable. If anyone is interesting in contacting this guy, his name is Howard and his twitter is... twitter.com/tenrikyotoronto
Whatever happened, hide is dead, let him rest in peace.
I am not interested in all those theories and talk abouts.
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hide being drunk out of his mind is not a new revelation. It has been stated on numerous occasions that he arrived home in the morning accompanied by his brother drunk out of his mind. Taiji has speculated in his book that this was the reason why he lost consciousness while trying to stretch and in the end managed to hang himself. Yoshiki shares this theory. It is called death by misadventure.
His death certificate called it accidental death. In the end same shit different pile. So, R.I.P. hide san. You will always be sadly missed by all.
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His death certificate called it accidental death.
I've heard that it was reported by the police and the newspapers as 'suicide'. Is that not true then? (not whether it was or not but whether the word 'suicide' was used.)
I can't know what the police said but in one of those videos that talk about his death and funeral I have clearly seen a newspaper with the word 'jisatsu' on the article title.
Of course the media often do report whatever they want but I was under the impression that what the media reported was the words of the police that were later changed by everyone to 'accident'.
Also, not that it matters, but I never believed it was an accident and I would like to know the full truth/details behind it. Not that I'm likely to ever will.
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His death certificate called it accidental death.
I've heard that it was reported by the police and the newspapers as 'suicide'. Is that not true then? (not whether it was or not but whether the word 'suicide' was used.)
I can't know what the police said but in one of those videos that talk about his death and funeral I have clearly seen a newspaper with the word 'jisatsu' on the article title.
Of course the media often do report whatever they want but I was under the impression that what the media reported was the words of the police that were later changed by everyone to 'accident'.
Also, not that it matters, but I never believed it was an accident and I would like to know the full truth/details behind it. Not that I'm likely to ever will.
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D00EFD7103DF93BA25755C0A96E958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all
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Great, thanks for the link...:-)
Now, could possibly anyone find me a link where Yoshiki states he believes it was an accident?
My memory could be off but in all of his interviews that I've read and watched (those subbed at least) I never heard him calling it an accident...though, I am really not famous for my memory skills.
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It's interesting isn't it? To be honest, I'd like to accept it but unless you knew more about this doctor from Sick Kids, her name and actually talked to her, then we'll never really know. It does make me feel a bit better because I've strongly felt that hide did not kill himself and that it was a tragedy/accident. All in all, it made my night at the concert just that much more unbelievable. If anyone is interesting in contacting this guy, his name is Howard and his twitter is... twitter.com/tenrikyotoronto
Whatever happened, hide is dead, let him rest in peace.
I am not interested in all those theories and talk abouts.
Like I said, this is a touchy subject for many people on here. Sorry to be blunt but if you don't like it, then don't read/comment on it. His death is mysterious and I don't think it's wrong to debate/think/wonder/ask questions about it. I find it keeps hide's spirit alive no matter how we discuss him. All I'm saying is what I was told and what you were apparently told by that guy at the Toronto show. It's just an insight into what probably happened and how.
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Like I said, this is a touchy subject for many people on here. Sorry to be blunt but if you don't like it, then don't read/comment on it. His death is mysterious and I don't think it's wrong to debate/think/wonder/ask questions about it. I find it keeps hide's spirit alive no matter how we discuss him. All I'm saying is what I was told and what you were apparently told by that guy at the Toronto show. It's just an insight into what probably happened and how.
I think that I am free to read and free to write just like you are.
I always thought it was an accident due to be too drunk, like Taiji and Yoshiki believe; people that I believe that knowed hide very well.
hide being drunk out of his mind is not a new revelation. It has been stated on numerous occasions that he arrived home in the morning accompanied by his brother drunk out of his mind. Taiji has speculated in his book that this was the reason why he lost consciousness while trying to stretch and in the end managed to hang himself. Yoshiki shares this theory. It is called death by misadventure.
His death certificate called it accidental death. In the end same shit different pile. So, R.I.P. hide san. You will always be sadly missed by all.
I agree!
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Like I said, this is a touchy subject for many people on here. Sorry to be blunt but if you don't like it, then don't read/comment on it. His death is mysterious and I don't think it's wrong to debate/think/wonder/ask questions about it. I find it keeps hide's spirit alive no matter how we discuss him. All I'm saying is what I was told and what you were apparently told by that guy at the Toronto show. It's just an insight into what probably happened and how.
I think that I am free to read and free to write just like you are.
I always thought it was an accident due to be too drunk, like Taiji and Yoshiki believe; people that I believe that knowed hide very well.
hide being drunk out of his mind is not a new revelation. It has been stated on numerous occasions that he arrived home in the morning accompanied by his brother drunk out of his mind. Taiji has speculated in his book that this was the reason why he lost consciousness while trying to stretch and in the end managed to hang himself. Yoshiki shares this theory. It is called death by misadventure.
His death certificate called it accidental death. In the end same shit different pile. So, R.I.P. hide san. You will always be sadly missed by all.
I agree!
Yea I know but you can't go and declare the topic null and void based on your opinion and say "I am not interested in all those theories and talk abouts." then come back and say you're free to write about it (which obviously everyone is). It's one or the other lol...
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I believe that in this case there TOO many things done behind the public's ( and not only) back. So it's quite impossible to be sure indeed.
Japan in 1998 was really quite a different thing than in 2010.
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I have send email to Matsumoto Hiroshi about this subject. Maybe he will response.
In japan alot of people believe hide was killed by his brother or his at the time girlfriend. I personal don't know what to believe
hide-sama is dead and is not come back. And sometime it is better not knowing the truth.
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Yea I know but you can't go and declare the topic null and void based on your opinion and say "I am not interested in all those theories and talk abouts." then come back and say you're free to write about it (which obviously everyone is). It's one or the other lol...
--> I don't expressed me very well I suppose: I'm not interested in the twitter account...
I was not in the concert, this guy told me that on facebook.
hide is dead, he will not come back whatever happened and I find it strange that the doctor told that to this guy whithout knowing him. It is not very discrete, that is something that I don't like. Doctors have to be discrete.
Anyway it is known that hide was too much drunk when he came home.
To Ana: I don't believe he was killed, I believe it was an accident, like Yoshiki and Taiji believe.
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It is not very discrete, that is something that I don't like. Doctors have to be discrete.
lol, you are correct, but you will be amazed by what kind of things doctors have done and are willilng to do.....of course I am not pointing this subject towards this specific doctor, I'm just saying.
...anyway, that's a bit of topic I guess
However, I need to disagree with anna_lepard and say that it's always up to the individual's choice whether he or she wants to know the truth. In my case, the truth must ALWAYS be revealed.
But anyway, concerning this case we can't exactly force answers out of them.
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I'm not sure I'm going to make a lot of sense but I'd like to add this to the discussion : I think the word suicide can be interpreted in many different ways. If hide drank to the point of actually dying, wether it be a conscious act or not, why not call it suicide? After all, no one forced him to drink, he did it himself, knowing that alcohol can cause death. So even though I believe it was an accident, I can understand why it was labelled 'suicide'.
As for this doctor... well, doctors can be really talkative when they want to be. Even if I usually don't buy half ot it, it wouldn't be the first time I hear rumors concerning celebrities coming from doctors.
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Suicide is intentional. If there is no evidence of intent it should not be labeled suicide.
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I received short message back . Hide did not have cut in head and there was done autopsy one the body "drunk suicide"
hide had high amount alcohol in his blood.
It was as the police stated.
More was not send in the email.
and there was said we prefer not to talk about situation with fans
and it was asked to not believe such crap
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This thread tooootally lost it's focus. =P
I gotta agree with Anna on this one.. There is no Grassy Knoll here, just an extremely regrettable mistake from one of the world's greatest musicians. Period. As much as one might like the glamor of suicide or want something more from a culprit than a towel, it is what it is. Leave it alone.
In other news... I'm having a party at my place on Dec. 10th, the friday, for hide. Each room with a TV is gonna be showing hide music videos or an X-Japan concert. We're gonna have drinks- Rusty Nail, Pink Spider, Blue Blood, etc- and some ice cream, a cake, etc.
Anyone else celebrating the day?
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In other news... I'm having a party at my place on Dec. 10th, the friday, for hide. Each room with a TV is gonna be showing hide music videos or an X-Japan concert. We're gonna have drinks- Rusty Nail, Pink Spider, Blue Blood, etc- and some ice cream, a cake, etc.
Anyone else celebrating the day?
May I have a Pink Spider, please? ;)
I'm accually gonna host an online art exhibit in his honour, like I do every year. A week long, starting from his birthday (Japan time), containing paintings and drawings and such. New for this year will be a pastry/confection-series though. I'm studying to become a pastry-chef/confectioner so it seemed like a good thing to add something sugary sweet like a cake or the like for his birthday. I'm working on it right now so we'll see how it turns out.
Other than that, I think I'll have the usuall celebration of eating good food and watching a marathon of all my hide-dvd's.^^
(if anyone's curious about the exhibit you can check out these two links;
http://www.facebook.com/lemoned.neko?v=app_2344061033#!/event.php?eid=147348965307819
http://rememberingpinkspider.blogspot.com/
The website for the exhibit will be announced later)
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This thread tooootally lost it's focus. =P
I gotta agree with Anna on this one.. There is no Grassy Knoll here, just an extremely regrettable mistake from one of the world's greatest musicians. Period. As much as one might like the glamor of suicide or want something more from a culprit than a towel, it is what it is. Leave it alone.
In other news... I'm having a party at my place on Dec. 10th, the friday, for hide. Each room with a TV is gonna be showing hide music videos or an X-Japan concert. We're gonna have drinks- Rusty Nail, Pink Spider, Blue Blood, etc- and some ice cream, a cake, etc.
Anyone else celebrating the day?
Depends. Decided not to go to the "birthday party", and then visiting his grave on his birthday fell through so I guess I'll to Harajuku and say hey to the Yellow House people or something. =/
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we will visit hide grave and leave flowers. after i don't know what we do.
i do not support any headwax organize.
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I don't like when he is honoured with alcohol.
Because it was probably the cause of his death and he seemed to drink too much.
Why must people always question the cause of his death?
I mean you don't have to believe everything what people tell you.
Also, were is the point in asking the management about it. They would never tell you anything.
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@ Nanami, I do totally agree with you, so why not rising a nice cup of tea on to his remembrance at his birthday or any other day we like, mindfully the fact that his drinking beyond all borders caused all grave loss to his family anf his friends and for us fans too. When I listen to "Unnamend Song" or "Without You" I think how many sadness and grief this one drunken night brought to many people, and may be still does...
and by the way it´s a bit funny, that LemonedNeko, who started this post isn´t able to get alcohol in the supermarket, but have to go to Systemet and spend a lot of money for it. I don´t know, if it works in Sweden, but sometimes I think, if it would more difficult to get alcohol, we won´t have that high nummer of coma drinking teens...
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I know this is an old post, and I just happen to stumble upon this site (think it is great) while tying to find out why "Pink Cloud Assembly' has 18 minutes of down time in it. No one seem to mention DOD. I wish someone could have got hide not to drink so much. But, I have been listening to rock long enough to have seen the death of too many talented people by drugs/alcohol over the last 40 years. Love hide's music!
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I know this is an old topic, here, and probably not a lot of people around to discuss or read things with. I am new to the site, not new to X though, but still consider myself very new as far as knowing things about the group and each person.
About a month ago, I was doing some searching around and found a blog that has some different information and explains some things. Of course, we never know if this stuff is true or not but it seems this writer is honest. I hope so.
Here is the blog then a blog link is in the 1st page that goes to a blog of Hiroshi's book and his accounting of the evening/morning that hide died.
It still all seems so very strange.
http://www.xjapantranslations.com/information-regarding-hides-death
http://nopperabou.net/hide-index/kyoudai-p201.htm
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I have read those too. Even did some research on who the guy really was and what could have caused his death back in the day.
I studied to be a therapist (even if that's not what I do right now) and the hard facts add up: Hide was quite fucked up. Except people kind of thought it was funny and part of his rock star status. Also, Japanese society tends to leave one to deal with one's problems alone - they just assume you'll pull through. He was an alcoholic who had already suffered a major head fracture that granted him a month in the hospital after he developped a bad edema. There are other reports of him breaking his leg bones while drunk. He mentions he had 3 stomach ulcers caused by drinking in the late 80s (note that he was only in his 20s back then). Smoked up to 6 packs of strong tobacco per day, according to himself. Also according to himself (months before his death), he was diagnosed "manic depressive" (the term at the time for bipolar disorder). According to Yoshiki he was bulimic (Yoshiki too seemed to think this was sort of funny). What else do you need to be miserable?
Too bad he died but if he hadn't died that night, he would have ended up dead not shortly afterwards. I vote it was a freak accident with underlying suicidal ideation brought on by being drunk off his ass. The modus operandi was pretty dumb, though, which is why I think it wasn't entirely premeditated. It's okay to discuss it, but I'm really dumbstruck someone here once reached out to his brother to confirm a baseless theory. Poor dude, let's hope he passed peacefully and that he's doing better, wherever he is.
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According to Yoshiki (and even Taiji) hide used a method they all used to relieve shoulder and neck pain from guitar playing. I forgot the specific term in English but I did look it up back then and it is a legitimate yoga move, with the use of a towel, to stretch muscles around the neck. Musicians believe it was an accident, because he tried to do this yoga move while drunk as shit. Sugizo said hide was prone to accidents when he drank, so probably he wouldn't have lived much longer, sadly :( Or probably would have ended up like Taiji, ruining his health completely and being unable to compose and perform due to his excess alcoholism. Also, the kind of music he was doing, started getting out of trend at the beginning of the 2000s. He probably would have been forgotten as a musician, had he lived. I know I'm not going to be popular with this opinion, but I think his untimely death is what made hide an icon that will stay in people's hearts for a long time. It elevated him to cult status.
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I have read those too. Even did some research on who the guy really was and what could have caused his death back in the day.
I studied to be a therapist (even if that's not what I do right now) and the hard facts add up: Hide was quite fucked up. Except people kind of thought it was funny and part of his rock star status. Also, Japanese society tends to leave one to deal with one's problems alone - they just assume you'll pull through. He was an alcoholic who had already suffered a major head fracture that granted him a month in the hospital after he developped a bad edema. There are other reports of him breaking his leg bones while drunk. He mentions he had 3 stomach ulcers caused by drinking in the late 80s (note that he was only in his 20s back then). Smoked up to 6 packs of strong tobacco per day, according to himself. Also according to himself (months before his death), he was diagnosed "manic depressive" (the term at the time for bipolar disorder). According to Yoshiki he was bulimic (Yoshiki too seemed to think this was sort of funny). What else do you need to be miserable?
Too bad he died but if he hadn't died that night, he would have ended up dead not shortly afterwards. I vote it was a freak accident with underlying suicidal ideation brought on by being drunk off his ass. The modus operandi was pretty dumb, though, which is why I think it wasn't entirely premeditated. It's okay to discuss it, but I'm really dumbstruck someone here once reached out to his brother to confirm a baseless theory. Poor dude, let's hope he passed peacefully and that he's doing better, wherever he is.
I can definitely see him being bulimic because of being made fun of as a child for his weight. He looked too thin in some ways to me almost to the point of being fragile as far as his shoulders and arms, maybe his chest and upper back as well. His legs looked ok, though.
I've read about a lot of his accidents, not in depth, however. But none the less, he had a lot and broke bones quite a lot as well. Not good.
How do you develop edema from a head fracture? Isn't edema fluid in the legs from heart problems? Or are there other types as well as cardiovascular associated edema?
I have seen him or should say, I saw him act silly all the time - that or pissed off at things. I agree with you that this type of person can easily be showing how funny they are on the outside while inside, they are hurting bad. I have quite a bit of experience with bi-polar people as my 1st ex husband was and is still unmedicated bi-polar. His brother, mother and grandfather were also bi-polar. What a mess. Anyway, IDK if hide was bi-polar or not. I can't form that opinion about someone without knowing them or at least being with them quite a bit to see the mood swings, crazy hyper thoughts, etc. I would just have to see it. I have seen a lot of people say they are bi-polar or that so and so is bi-polar and they were using the phrase as a catch all or just a label for someone's behavior without having enough of a real diagnosis. You know what I am talking about, I bet. Oh and I am not saying that is what you were meaning or doing. Just that maybe or maybe not, hide did that and said that.
As much as he drank and smoked (holy smokes that's a lot of cigarettes per day) he was killing himself as it was. He was somewhat wreckless, perhaps, in other things but I don't know that or at least not yet.
Yes, poor guy. I do hope he is happy, now. He seemed to be such a lovely person with that so sweet smile as he would look on at the crowds of people. It just melted my heart to see that smile.
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According to Yoshiki (and even Taiji) hide used a method they all used to relieve shoulder and neck pain from guitar playing. I forgot the specific term in English but I did look it up back then and it is a legitimate yoga move, with the use of a towel, to stretch muscles around the neck. Musicians believe it was an accident, because he tried to do this yoga move while drunk as shit. Sugizo said hide was prone to accidents when he drank, so probably he wouldn't have lived much longer, sadly :( Or probably would have ended up like Taiji, ruining his health completely and being unable to compose and perform due to his excess alcoholism. Also, the kind of music he was doing, started getting out of trend at the beginning of the 2000s. He probably would have been forgotten as a musician, had he lived. I know I'm not going to be popular with this opinion, but I think his untimely death is what made hide an icon that will stay in people's hearts for a long time. It elevated him to cult status.
I know what you are talking about. It's a chiropractic technique known as traction procedure or just traction. I've had it done to me by chiropractors for full body stretching. It lines up the bones in the neck, back, even legs and gets them back in place where they belong and if they were compressed from activity, it releases that compression. I feel GREAT after my chiropractor does it and sometimes they will just stand behind me as I am laying on the table, take ahold of my head and pull backwards, stretching my neck. It really helps a LOT!
From what I have read, the towel was around his chin, not his neck. You can't hang yourself by your chin. He would have had to have tied the towel around his neck, not placed it under his chin. I think he was drunk as hell, but still in pain and decided to relieve the pain and possibly passed out from the alcohol and slipped into a bad position that cut off his circulation to the brain enough to kill him.
He was very, very talented and had a huge following. He could have switched doing things the way he did but still keep playing the type of music he liked, although his later music with his own bands was getting a bit silly if you ask me. What he did with X Japan was damn outstanding and above all the other guitarists at that time. He was very sadly overlooked for recognition due to probably the fact he was Asian and no one really recognizes Asian or Japanese lead guitarists. Damn shame!
You are right. If he had stayed on the same path, he would have ruined himself forever and died because of it, unless he sought help and got it and stuck with it.
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How do you develop edema from a head fracture? Isn't edema fluid in the legs from heart problems? Or are there other types as well as cardiovascular associated edema?
umm, Wikipedia is quite useful in things like this ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_edema
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Yeah hide was successful back then in solo, too but not more successful than with X Japan. His best sales as solo were around 500,000 copies (and that's counting posthumous sales of those albums/singles, too). His most successful album Ja, Zoo was released after his death and culminated at 1.4 million. Pink Spider sold 1 million copies as a single, also released after his death. For example, Rocket Dive, which was released in January 1998, only reached 4th place on Oricon (versus posthumous Pink Spider debuting at Nr1.) The highest place he reached with his singles on Oricon while alive was nr3. His Psyence album did debut as Nr1 though in 1996. But none of the singles from it reached the top of the charts.
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How do you develop edema from a head fracture? Isn't edema fluid in the legs from heart problems? Or are there other types as well as cardiovascular associated edema?
umm, Wikipedia is quite useful in things like this ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_edema
Damn, that's about as bad as a cerebral aneurysm because either way, if the cranial cavity fills up with fluid, it cuts off the circulation to the brain.
I wish they had done an autopsy and made sure exactly what happened especially with Hiroshi saying he heard all kind of "violent" throwing of objects, etc.
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He was successful-ish in his genre, he had a bit of a cult following that was not negligible. Not sure if he would have made it outside of Japan, though. He was an awesome guitarist but not a good vocalist. I believe most of his solo lyrics were written by others and then arranged by him. Unpopular opinion: his solo career was designed to exploit the recognition he already had as X's guitarist. Take the guitar away and he was just an itty-bitty thing with a camera-friendly face and a kickass sense of fashion that made teenage girls go wild. Read, a money-making machine, if exploited correctly.
They did an autopsy and toxicology on his body, I think, but the results were obviously not made public. If Hiroshi is to be believed, his brother was becoming more and more violent as the years passed. Which is consistent with bipolar and a lot of other things. I don't think he was abnormally thin, but again, bulimics usually aren't. In interviews, he mentioned it multiple times times that he disliked his physique and deliberately avoided showing skin. In his book, Yoshiki recalls "funny" episodes of him running to the bathroom to throw up if he felt that he overate. Yoshiki reportedly kept him company and made himself throw up as well so his friend wouldn't feel so bad. (yeah, WTF)
As for the towel stretching theory, it's plausible, but it has a few gaps that will never be filled because well, the dude is ded. 8) And gladly there are no pictures or graphic descriptions of the death scene on the internet. I can't quite fanthom how you can accidentally hang yourself with a towel on a doorknob, as drunk as you might be (which he reportedly wasn't, says his bro). When I was interning as a therapist, one of my supervisor's patients comitted suicide in a similar way. Went to a hotel room and hung himself with his belt on the coat rack. He snapped his airpipe by dropping to his knees, which were about an inch off the floor. That one too was midly drunk and had a psychotic spectrum syndrome. TL;DR: Unstable people might not act on suicidal impulses when sober, but take advantage of the desensitization provided by alcohol and drugs to do the deed once and for all.
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His friends all said he was nowhere near a suicidal type, and they don't believe he would have killed himself. There is nothing that supports the suicide theory, his bulimia or bipolar disorder is just not enough evidence. I will go with the opinion of people that actually knew him. he was drunk, there are several people who testify he had a drunk fit before his brother drove him home. his things were going well, he also had a girlfriend. the previous day he had a long tv interview. why would he suddenly just decide to kill himself - in the presence of his girlfriend? that poor woman though, finding your boyfriend hanging from a doorknob.
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His friends all said he was nowhere near a suicidal type, and they don't believe he would have killed himself. There is nothing that supports the suicide theory, his bulimia or bipolar disorder is just not enough evidence. I will go with the opinion of people that actually knew him. he was drunk, there are several people who testify he had a drunk fit before his brother drove him home. his things were going well, he also had a girlfriend. the previous day he had a long tv interview. why would he suddenly just decide to kill himself - in the presence of his girlfriend? that poor woman though, finding your boyfriend hanging from a doorknob.
Responding backwards, here, as I will respond to matsumoto as soon as I get a chance.
I read all of that and pretty much agree with it. He had just bought property to build himself a new house with a recording studio or at least studio to practice in as well. I know how that goes, having been run out of an apartment because my ex's guitar strumming (acoustic and not hooked up to an amp, either) caused the neighbors to go mad with threats of the police for the "loud guitar playing" cough, lol, so he must have been really happy and excited to get the deal done and underway. It seemed he had every reason to be happy, other than the fight with the band mates but that was also reported by other friends and band mates? that it was the usual and he did that often. Alcohol will do that for sure. I remember my days of fighting while I was drunk only to wonder why in the hell I had to go do that and in front of a bunch of people, no less. LOL!
If the girl who found him was a real girlfriend, like we would think "girlfriend" or "boyfriend" that must have been a terrible shock. Even if not, still a terrible shock. Apparently she got him out of the towel contraption before the ambulance arrived. And that's another thing - as far as that one report went, it took the ambulance an hour to get to his place, when it was only a 7 minute drive. WTF?!? He was reported to still be breathing at that time as well. Just think if they had gotten there within minutes or so.
Anyway I have never seen any interviews or read them, regarding her or anything she may have had to say. Was she told to keep her mouth shut? Was she just too bummed out to say anything? Was she at his funeral and what became of her? Questions that go through my mind.
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He was successful-ish in his genre, he had a bit of a cult following that was not negligible. Not sure if he would have made it outside of Japan, though. He was an awesome guitarist but not a good vocalist. I believe most of his solo lyrics were written by others and then arranged by him. Unpopular opinion: his solo career was designed to exploit the recognition he already had as X's guitarist. Take the guitar away and he was just an itty-bitty thing with a camera-friendly face and a kickass sense of fashion that made teenage girls go wild. Read, a money-making machine, if exploited correctly.
They did an autopsy and toxicology on his body, I think, but the results were obviously not made public. If Hiroshi is to be believed, his brother was becoming more and more violent as the years passed. Which is consistent with bipolar and a lot of other things. I don't think he was abnormally thin, but again, bulimics usually aren't. In interviews, he mentioned it multiple times times that he disliked his physique and deliberately avoided showing skin. In his book, Yoshiki recalls "funny" episodes of him running to the bathroom to throw up if he felt that he overate. Yoshiki reportedly kept him company and made himself throw up as well so his friend wouldn't feel so bad. (yeah, WTF)
As for the towel stretching theory, it's plausible, but it has a few gaps that will never be filled because well, the dude is ded. 8) And gladly there are no pictures or graphic descriptions of the death scene on the internet. I can't quite fanthom how you can accidentally hang yourself with a towel on a doorknob, as drunk as you might be (which he reportedly wasn't, says his bro). When I was interning as a therapist, one of my supervisor's patients comitted suicide in a similar way. Went to a hotel room and hung himself with his belt on the coat rack. He snapped his airpipe by dropping to his knees, which were about an inch off the floor. That one too was midly drunk and had a psychotic spectrum syndrome. TL;DR: Unstable people might not act on suicidal impulses when sober, but take advantage of the desensitization provided by alcohol and drugs to do the deed once and for all.
Yes awesome guitarist but not a very good singer. Still, not that bad, either. But nowhere as good as Toshi.
I didn't really pay attention but was he signed with Sony? Sony is a terrible group to get stuck with. I remember the fights that Michael Jackson had with them and them forcing him to do things he didn't want to do, etc. They would be the type to capitalize on hide's good looks and talents. But possibly not as he wasn't that great of a singer as you say.
Going back to types, etc. He was silly and joking all the time on stage or most of it. But then I am much the same way although rarely if ever depressed and certainly not bipolar but I would never want to kill myself, I don't think. It would have to be something so monumental in my life that I felt there was nothing left to live for and I would have to be totally alone in life and feeling deep remorse because of it to want to do something like that. But even then, I would probably pull myself out of those types of thoughts and feelings within 24 hours and come back "swinging" as they say. But then, I am not him, did not have the life experiences he had, etc. He just had so much to live for and was living the dream, as they say.
That incident of your co-worker or friend's patient hanging themselves from a coat rack is different. The guy? was definitely trying to kill himself if he put a belt around his neck and hanging from a coat hanger is much, much higher up than a door nob which is just around 2-1/2 to 3 foot from the floor. That's something I don't think anyone would even consider using to hang themselves. Seems they would look for something much higher in order to do it. The chances of that working while sitting on the floor are pretty slim if next to not at all. That part just does not make any sense to me in regards to a suicide. Decompressing his vertebrae in his neck is another thing and that would work but not for hanging yourself. It just doesn't add up to me.
I am appalled that Yoshiki would more or less egg him on with throwing up and even throw up with him so he wouldn't feel "so bad" about it. Good grief! I am disappointed.
I know we have to resign ourselves to the fact that we will never know but talking about it and wondering about it will always be there unless someone does come forward with the full story.
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There is nothing outstanding in Yoshiki's reaction to hide's bulimia. Mind you, we watch this with our Westernized backgrounds, education and cultural expectations.
Yoshiki and hide grew up in a Japanese society that really does NOT teach people how to react in such situations. As matsumoto said before, Japanese society leaves people to struggle with their own problems, because you are expected to solve your own issues yourself. It's not by chance that still today, there is so much suicide in Japan. If you cannot deal with your own issues, you are completely left alone. Psychotherapy is also rare, people view it in Asian conservative societies as something you need to be ashamed of, not as a form of help to solve your problems. Yoshiki is just as fucked up as hide, but he pulls through because he has an extreme willpower. But he is also seriously messed up mentally and unwilling to seek help.
Same with Toshi's brainwashing. Nobody in the band or even in his own family ever asked Toshi why he was getting estranged, nobody offered him help to solve his problems. Nobody went to him asking these things when he visibly broke down on stage during the Dahlia tour, an early sign of his internal turmoil. Yoshiki went to pat his back, and watch him with apparent pity, and that was it. I bet, he didn't ask any questions to him backstage. And even he would have, Toshi would have probably refused to talk about his problems. Because again, Japanese upbringing. This is why, I believe, his wife and Masaya could have such extreme control over him later, because these people were the only ones who pretended to listen (in order to recruit him to the cult) and seemed to offer him a way out of his inner struggles (which only intensified later, but it was too late for him to realize that, getting completely under their control).
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I very much agree with what Teemeah said. It's pretty hard to put your finger on certain things when you're a westerner. Fifty years ago Yoshiki would totally have been lobotomy material in Europe. Or he'd have had his balls poisoned with massive ammounts of radiation in an attempt to make him more manly (yeah, they did that back in the day)
As for Hide, the Hide we knew was just the tip of the iceberg - i.e. a guy who showed up on stage, played the guitar, modelled for pictures and gave out some rather cringy interviews. We have no idea what the dude was like IRL, what he was thinking most of the time, who he hung out with besides equally famous bandmates, what real life problems he had to deal with, what kept him up at night, etc. It's tempting to believe we know more about public figures than we actually do.
That being said, I'm glad the people who knew him well aren't coming forward and sharing further sordid details. His family is mostly private about it and that's a great thing. His brother wrote a book about him but stayed within the my-brother-was-awesome limits and that's great. The identity of his girlfriend was never disclosed and that's great too. Finding your SO hanging from a doorknob sounds like a pretty shitty life experience. I most certainly wouldn't want to read a graphic description of the scene. I've seen two suicide scenes when I was interning in a psych ward (including one by hanging) and let me tell you, IT SUCKS. Had my stomach in knots for months afterwards. As Frida Khalo said, I hope the dude passed joyfully and I hope he never returns. ;)
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Yea, the Japanese are so reserved as far as sharing things with others. You have to wonder how that really feels, psychologically and what it does to a person to be brought up that way and live that way. Not that I think they are bad people at all and in fact, in many respects, much better than westerners are. I wonder why they evolved that way as far as customs go. I know I have (don't laugh) Mongol in my very distant background and that even shows in DNA testing. I wonder what they were like and it's interesting to think about. But strange in some ways that they must keep things in, yet it doesn't appear that anger is one of them.
I suppose it would depend on what kind of suicide a person committed as to what walking in on someone who did it, used if I am making sense. These tiny boxes to write in are sometimes difficult to use because you can't see what you just wrote. Hahahaha.
Wouldn't subjecting one's balls to massive amounts of radiation make a man sterile? Seems it would. I think they used something like that to try to cure my uncle of Malaria after WWII and that made him sterile.
Anyway, there are many musicians who tell their whole story or their friends and band mates tell the stories of how things used to be when they were younger or just life experiences. I am so used to that, that this is almost to the point of frustrating or the complete opposite of musicians I have known, etc. So it's unusual for me to experience people who won't let their real selves show to the public, unless they actually have something to hide.
Yea, hope he passed, peacefully.
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A lot of this kind of behaviour and social values boil down to Confucianism, which was adapted to Japanese society as early as the 7th century. The dude's teaching really fucked East Asia up. Of course, some things are nice values, like respect for the elderly and filial piety but somehow his teaching were taken too seriously, almost letter to letter and in some societies, like in Korea, they became hard-edged rules that cannot be broken. And sadly, they still prevail. So let's thank Confucius and his disciples for these fucked up Japanese artists :)
Edit: of course it is not so simple, as the development of a society is a complex process. Just saying that Confucianism in general had a great impact on East Asian behavioral patterns and societal/ethical rules.
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A lot of this kind of behaviour and social values boil down to Confucianism, which was adapted to Japanese society as early as the 7th century. The dude's teaching really fucked East Asia up. Of course, some things are nice values, like respect for the elderly and filial piety but somehow his teaching were taken too seriously, almost letter to letter and in some societies, like in Korea, they became hard-edged rules that cannot be broken. And sadly, they still prevail. So let's thank Confucius and his disciples for these fucked up Japanese artists :)
But Confucius was Chinese. How does that work, then? I was always told Chinese don't like Japanese and vice versa. What were the Japanese before they were Japanese? I know there is a difference in the way they look and I much prefer Japanese. Take for instance, Yoshiki when he was younger and maybe around 18 or 15 or somewhere between there. OMG, he was so gorgeous. Whatever that picture is that comes up in google searches with him wearing what looks like a military uniform. He was to die for, IMHO. His looks seem to have changed a lot in his bone structure in his nose and face. Hmmm. Maybe it was just becoming more mature, physically as far as looks.
But, yes, that is what always attracted me to people from that part of the world - the respect for elders and older members of the family. My family was much like that as well. I have roots in so many parts of the world and the Slovaks are the ones who had that same respect for elders and it is through them I have the Mongol heritige, as little as that is - somewhere around 2% which is nothing much at all but I wonder if it somehow passed down via my ancestor's genes or just in observing my aunt, especially. She was very, very respectful of anyone older than her and I tried to emulate her because I adored her. So reading, hearing and watching what little I could, about Japanese people, I wanted to know more and to get to know them better. Maybe even live there. Ha. They would probably kick me out cause I am too wild, otherwise. Hahahahaha!
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Ohh, you know, what you say is probably very true about the Koreans, too. I believe our neighbors across the street are Korean. I don't know where you live but I am in the USA. We just moved here about 5 years ago then they bought the house there about 3 years ago. They actually came over and asked us to take down our Halloween decorations because it was bad vibes of some sort, towards their home. WTF?!? Pissed me off big time. Move somewhere else if you can't handle the customs and certainly don't try to change what is in the country you just moved to. SMH! LOL. Kinda ruined Halloween for me. I had even bought myself a hide wig just to wear around the house and I was so mad, I didn't even put the wig on cause why bother if there is nothing else to celebrate and have fun with.
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A lot of this kind of behaviour and social values boil down to Confucianism, which was adapted to Japanese society as early as the 7th century. The dude's teaching really fucked East Asia up. Of course, some things are nice values, like respect for the elderly and filial piety but somehow his teaching were taken too seriously, almost letter to letter and in some societies, like in Korea, they became hard-edged rules that cannot be broken. And sadly, they still prevail. So let's thank Confucius and his disciples for these fucked up Japanese artists :)
But Confucius was Chinese. How does that work, then? I was always told Chinese don't like Japanese and vice versa. What were the Japanese before they were Japanese? I know there is a difference in the way they look and I much prefer Japanese. Take for instance, Yoshiki when he was younger and maybe around 18 or 15 or somewhere between there. OMG, he was so gorgeous. Whatever that picture is that comes up in google searches with him wearing what looks like a military uniform. He was to die for, IMHO. His looks seem to have changed a lot in his bone structure in his nose and face. Hmmm. Maybe it was just becoming more mature, physically as far as looks.
But, yes, that is what always attracted me to people from that part of the world - the respect for elders and older members of the family. My family was much like that as well. I have roots in so many parts of the world and the Slovaks are the ones who had that same respect for elders and it is through them I have the Mongol heritige, as little as that is - somewhere around 2% which is nothing much at all but I wonder if it somehow passed down via my ancestor's genes or just in observing my aunt, especially. She was very, very respectful of anyone older than her and I tried to emulate her because I adored her. So reading, hearing and watching what little I could, about Japanese people, I wanted to know more and to get to know them better. Maybe even live there. Ha. They would probably kick me out cause I am too wild, otherwise. Hahahahaha!
I suggest you read up on Confucianism, and you will understand. We are talking about 7th century Japan and on, not WWII and beyond. Confucianism had a profound effect on East Asia. Chinese culture was brought over to both Korea and Japan very early, no wonder Japanese also use Chinese writing TO DAY ;) It's a complex process and a lot of historical things are involved in it. It's too complicated to just sum it up in two sentences on a forum.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edo_Neo-Confucianism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_philosophy
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Thanks! I will check that out when I have more time. I am not one for trusting Wiki that much as, here, it is banned from being used in schools due to it's lack of accuracy and the ability of anyone and everyone being able to alter it. No offense, ok? I want to check out some more details and possibly talk to a couple of guys I know who are Buddhist who may be able to shed some light on it as well. I don't know how much they know about Confucius and his teachings but I will find out!
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Thanks! I will check that out when I have more time. I am not one for trusting Wiki that much as, here, it is banned from being used in schools due to it's lack of accuracy and the ability of anyone and everyone being able to alter it. No offense, ok? I want to check out some more details and possibly talk to a couple of guys I know who are Buddhist who may be able to shed some light on it as well. I don't know how much they know about Confucius and his teachings but I will find out!
LOL. Wikipedia is pretty reliable nowadays. The articles are sourced, you can check the references, if they are reliable. Of course if you see unreferenced articles or articles tagged for any serious problems, you can be cautious. Wikipedia has already grown out of the "oooh so unreliable" phase loooong ago. Serious scientists contribute to articles and articles are much more trustworthy there than random blogs people DO read instead. LOL. :) I've been writing Wikipedia for 12 years now and I know how it works and where it stands right now. I always laugh so hard when people criticize Wikipedia for not being reliable but themselves go and read (and trust) forum replies and random blogs, and Facebook posts.... On Wikipedia you can at least CHECK the sources the articles are based on, so you can decide whether you trust the content or not. Still, people would rather believe a random Facebook meme where the sources are not even displayed. Sorry, but I cannot take this criticism seriously. No offense ;)
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LOL, I never trust Facebook posts nor memes. LOL. If I suspect it may be true, I do look it up on multiple news sources before I trust anything! I'm glad Wikipedia has improved, greatly, then. So I shall read that once I am done doing this research I am working on, totally unrelated to any music or living people for that matter. LOL.
Thank you for that valuable information, though. It saves me a lot of time. 8)
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Just butting in to say that yeah, in the early 20th Century people were almost completely unaware of how bad radiation could be for you. Guys who looked/acted unmanly were advised to have radiation therapy on their balls - which obviously didn't work and made them sterile, if it didn't give them testicular cancer or multiple other cancers. Einar Wegener, later known as Lily Elbe, is an example of a guy who underwent radiation therapy for his sexually "deviant" behaviour (was actually transgender). Be glad you are alive in 2017, everyone.
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I hope that "treatment" for having sexually deviant behavior wasn't forced on him, her? I looked him/her up real quick. Nice lips! LOL.
Yea, I am glad I am alive in this time although some times seemed to have been a lot better in some ways. Definitely not all these stupid superstitious things, though, and "treatments".
I have a cousin who is much, much older than me. When I was a little kid, her mother was taking her to the state hospital for shock treatments. She would come out of there acting like she was in a trance. You couldn't speak to her or anything. She just sat there staring straight ahead. Scared the hell outta me and I'd run off and go into the woods for the day. ROTLFOL
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She was a her, Lily Elbe. They made a fantastic film about her called The Danish Girl, featuring Eddie Redmayne. 8)
It wasn't forced on her but doctors were completely clueless because they'd literally never seen a guy who claimed he was actually a woman. She died during sex reassignment surgery.
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That's really sad that she died during the surgery that she probably desperately needed, mentally and physically as well. :(