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Yoshiki ft. Hyde : Red Swan

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Teemeah

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on: July 22, 2018, 05:45:18 PM
Let's have its own topic, because it is out now, kederiku@discord found these:

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/track/3qpNyeV4wr3YeCVfrosVyN?si=m5yvAWZBTLahrjTFG6bkng

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3udm-cFzG_c

It's just the TV edit so far, so 1:30 mins long.

« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 06:00:25 PM by Teemeah »



Offline nb

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Reply #1 on: July 22, 2018, 05:51:21 PM
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et5-QQs6e6k

It's just the TV edit so far, so 1:30 mins long.

it's angel...

this is the correct link =)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3udm-cFzG_c


positively unsure。


Offline axlroseX

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Reply #2 on: July 22, 2018, 05:52:12 PM
Definitely shouldn't in any way, shape, or form be called an X Japan song. With no Toshi I don't find this song memorable. I miss Yoshiki writing solid rock songs.

However, I am glad he changed the name



Teemeah

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Reply #3 on: July 22, 2018, 06:00:44 PM
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et5-QQs6e6k

It's just the TV edit so far, so 1:30 mins long.

it's angel...

this is the correct link =)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3udm-cFzG_c

sorry, had wrong window open. corrected it.



Offline nb

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Reply #4 on: July 22, 2018, 06:01:12 PM
This song is really better than I thought it could be.

Really.

I like it very much.

Best thing: Hyde did'nt do this gackt thing.


positively unsure。


Teemeah

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Reply #5 on: July 22, 2018, 06:02:08 PM
Definitely shouldn't in any way, shape, or form be called an X Japan song. With no Toshi I don't find this song memorable. I miss Yoshiki writing solid rock songs.

However, I am glad he changed the name

I like it though, it's catchy. Not outstanding and feels like it was quickly thrown together (they were probably asked to do it quite late), but it's a nice song so far. I hope there will be a full length version out. With Toshi...



Offline nb

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Reply #6 on: July 22, 2018, 06:10:04 PM
Definitely shouldn't in any way, shape, or form be called an X Japan song.

Definitely you can say this about every song since 1996 if you put another singer than Toshi in it. But ... I'm tired discussing this  ;D


positively unsure。


Offline axlroseX

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Reply #7 on: July 22, 2018, 06:17:05 PM
Definitely shouldn't in any way, shape, or form be called an X Japan song.

Definitely you can say this about every song since 1996 if you put another singer than Toshi in it. But ... I'm tired discussing this  ;D

Except Toshi is the singer, so what are you trying to say?



Offline Kasumi

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Reply #8 on: July 22, 2018, 06:20:23 PM
I like it a lot. :D Hyde did a good job here. But yeah it sounds more like a Yoshiki solo project thing than an X Japan thing. ^^ It however does not sound like a Hyde solo thing. Hyde's songwriting is different. You can clearly hear Yoshikis hand in it.

While I'm away, read this line again...


Offline nb

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Reply #9 on: July 22, 2018, 06:22:50 PM
Definitely shouldn't in any way, shape, or form be called an X Japan song.

Definitely you can say this about every song since 1996 if you put another singer than Toshi in it. But ... I'm tired discussing this  ;D

Except Toshi is the singer, so what are you trying to say?

That there is no proper X song for which I was falling in love with them in the first place. Maybe it's my fault, but I'm a long haired metal head and I like very fast songs with high pitched voices and a lot of guitar soli in it  :)

Songs like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nM__lPTWThU or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f07Q6ncvlqI

What do you think about these songs?  ;)
« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 06:25:39 PM by nb »


positively unsure。


Offline Fluffy

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Reply #10 on: July 22, 2018, 07:03:20 PM
I think the song is 'signature' Yoshiki. I couldn't help but laugh at the whispering in the middle ' what's the truth, what to believe' which is appropriate given the reactions from all the fans with the whole Toshi/X Japan fuss.

I like this and think it would work well for an anime but i'm not a full on metal head and it was the classical elements with Yoshiki and Sugizo that pulled me down the X Japan rabbit hole! I think it works well for the reason it was made. I'd like to hear a longer version than what we have here. I also like the Yoshiki piano solo that he did for this too.



Offline matsumoto

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Reply #11 on: July 22, 2018, 07:48:39 PM
Finally got to listen to it! Sounds like a decent song, a bit too pop and generic for my taste, but hey, it's supposed to be an anime opening after all!  8) I love the AOL-ish vibes. Hyde's vocals are okay, he's not my cup of tea, but I don't mind him here.

Agree that this sounds very much like a Yoshiki song, doesn't quite fit X Japan's universe. I'm curious to hear a full band version, though.


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Offline pt_93

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Reply #12 on: July 22, 2018, 07:49:59 PM
I’m glad he didn’t name it X Japan because it’s literally the worst marketing ever, Attack On Titan fans hate it so I don’t think he gained much from this. I don’t really like it, sorry lol Hyde sounds great and I like that but the song is very generic.



Offline magucathy

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Reply #13 on: July 22, 2018, 09:50:39 PM
Finally got to listen to it! Sounds like a decent song, a bit too pop and generic for my taste, but hey, it's supposed to be an anime opening after all!  8) I love the AOL-ish vibes. Hyde's vocals are okay, he's not my cup of tea, but I don't mind him here.

Agree that this sounds very much like a Yoshiki song, doesn't quite fit X Japan's universe. I'm curious to hear a full band version, though.



You said all what I wanted to say.  ;)



Offline returner

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Reply #14 on: July 23, 2018, 12:39:44 AM
I love it. It's very beautiful and I hope we get to hear the whole thing soon. It's precious sounding.

I'm also surprisingly pleased with how Hyde sang on this. I was his fan for quite a while and even saw Vamps in the US when they visited, but I've lost touch with his music and was under the impression that he'd gotten a little goaty... but he's clear and ringy on this song with a little bit of edge.

Also, I love when Yoshiki whispers in songs XD I think he says something before, "what's the truth," too, but I can't make it out.

We are not trying to keep the legacy—we are trying to move forward, so our sound is going to change. I’m ready to be criticized, for example by fans saying "you should rather be this style." I’m ready for it, I’m okay with any concept of criticism-Yoshiki


Offline axlroseX

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Reply #15 on: July 23, 2018, 01:05:05 AM
Definitely shouldn't in any way, shape, or form be called an X Japan song.

Definitely you can say this about every song since 1996 if you put another singer than Toshi in it. But ... I'm tired discussing this  ;D

Except Toshi is the singer, so what are you trying to say?

That there is no proper X song for which I was falling in love with them in the first place. Maybe it's my fault, but I'm a long haired metal head and I like very fast songs with high pitched voices and a lot of guitar soli in it  :)

Songs like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nM__lPTWThU or this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f07Q6ncvlqI

What do you think about these songs?  ;)

I love speed metal X and modern X. I'm not referring to the sound. It isn't X Japan in any way, because Toshi isn't there. Yoshiki deciding to have zero original members, and forgoing Toshi for Hyde was disrespectful and not true "X Japan". Now, I realize I am a hypocrite because I supported GNR with just Axl, but I did internally recognize that wasn't the same band as before. It is also different imo, because Toshi is actively in the band, is apparently friends with Yoshiki, and wasn't truly consulted about this. It proves to me that Yoshiki did this all himself, and is now in damage control mode because of the backlash. It was a jerk move, that's all there is to it. I don't think Yoshiki is a bad person, but I think this was a poor and selfish decision. Sure, having "just" Yoshiki and Toshi on songs like La Venus and Without You may seem like the same thing as just having Yoshiki and Sugizo, but it isn't. Those two founded this band together, regardless of how much control Yoshiki has, that fact cannot be disputed. I love Sugizo, but he has "only" been in the band since 2010, and wasn't around when they were truly making waves. He is also only on 3 studio releases, one of which he is barely audible in. Again, I love the dude, and none of that is a knock to him. He IS a full fledged member of the band that has my admiration and respect as a fan, and I would love for him to finally be featured on a full album. I'd love to hear his guitar and violin be showcased on new songs, and that is up to Yoshiki. However, he is not an equal to Toshi no matter what anyone says.

Now for the song, I listened to this new clip just now. Last week, I found one that wasn't as full. It isn't a bad sounding song, but man, after all that hype for ANOTHER announcement... zero info to the album, a "new" song that isn't even an X Japan song, and now all this added controversy. It is, once again, a true disappointment. Especially after I said I wanted to try and be a positive fan. Yoshiki just makes it SO DIFFICULT. The song sounds like a typical Yoshiki pop ballad without the added magic of Toshi. I also can't really hear Sugizo's violin, which was the one thing I was excited for.

I went from thinking the announcement surely being about the album, then thinking since it was a high energy anime we'd get a new studio rock X Japan song, to realizing it is ANOTHER ballad that isn't X Japan, to now learning this series of events actually FRACTURED Toshi and Yoshiki's relationship due to Yoshiki's selfishness. I am sure things will be "fine" for the band continuing, but Toshi is clearly disappointed because of Yoshiki's "betrayal", and that alone makes this whole thing a colossal failure and mess. So, Red Swan is an indisputable disaster. For fuck's sake, Yoshiki...

Back to waiting...
« Last Edit: July 23, 2018, 01:12:59 AM by axlroseX »



Offline Kasumi

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Reply #16 on: July 23, 2018, 10:39:57 AM
Woooo wait a second. How do you know that Yoshiki and Toshi are having a fight right now or that they are not getting along? These are all assumptions we make, right? And he never said that he was angry at Yoshiki for doing this, right? Just that he was a bit surprised/irritated. Their friendship didn't end, right?

While I'm away, read this line again...


Offline nb

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Reply #17 on: July 23, 2018, 10:42:27 AM

I went from thinking the announcement surely being about the album, (...)

But to be fair no one ever said it would be an announcement about the album. It was just your imagination. Maybe that's why you were so critical of the song from the beginning?


positively unsure。


Offline matsumoto

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Reply #18 on: July 23, 2018, 12:19:19 PM
(...)to now learning this series of events actually FRACTURED Toshi and Yoshiki's relationship due to Yoshiki's selfishness. I am sure things will be "fine" for the band continuing, but Toshi is clearly disappointed because of Yoshiki's "betrayal", and that alone makes this whole thing a colossal failure and mess. So, Red Swan is an indisputable disaster. For fuck's sake, Yoshiki...

Woooo wait a second. How do you know that Yoshiki and Toshi are having a fight right now or that they are not getting along? These are all assumptions we make, right? And he never said that he was angry at Yoshiki for doing this, right? Just that he was a bit surprised/irritated. Their friendship didn't end, right?

90% of it is fan speculation. The remaining 10% is Toshi saying he was a little bummed on an (unrelated) video. We can make whatever we want of it, but I wouldn't go as far as saying they're having a fight (well, to be fully fair, if the guy went on screen and let slip that he was bummed, there's a good chance he was seriously bummed about it - and it's understandable to say the least. But we have no way of knowing more, and I don't think they're going to air their dirty laundry in public - or at least I hope not)


It proves to me that Yoshiki did this all himself, and is now in damage control mode because of the backlash. It was a jerk move, that's all there is to it. I don't think Yoshiki is a bad person, but I think this was a poor and selfish decision.

Sasasama gave us a resume of the interview where he 'defended' himself on this topic (check it out on Discord). According to him, he was too busy to care and it only dawned on him that it could be a bad move when the backslash started. He allegedly tried talking to Toshi first, but "because of various reasons", he couldn't get through to him. At some point he seems to say that "it [the song?] would have been better with X Japan" but that they didn't do it as a band "because a lot of things happened". He takes full responsibility for it, though. TL;DR: he doesn't make a lot of sense, our dear frontman is just hella kooky  8)

« Last Edit: July 23, 2018, 12:30:07 PM by matsumoto »

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Offline axlroseX

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Reply #19 on: July 23, 2018, 12:33:03 PM
He's in damage control mode. What he said makes zero sense

Its not fan speculation, Toshi clearly wasnt consulted and is upset. That alone makes this a mess as it shows Yoshiki didnt have the respect or decency to include him



Teemeah

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Reply #20 on: July 23, 2018, 03:44:52 PM
He's in damage control mode. What he said makes zero sense

Its not fan speculation, Toshi clearly wasnt consulted and is upset. That alone makes this a mess as it shows Yoshiki didnt have the respect or decency to include him

No, you are speculating. Toshi never said he wasn't consulted, or that he is clearly upset. You are making judgements based on a few sentences of poilte Japanese conversation, and try to sell it as facts. The real fact is however, that we don't know shit about the real reasons or how Toshi feels or why Yoshiki made decisions, or who influenced him (if anyone), and what really went down behind the scenes. it IS purely fan speculation, and YOU are giving words into their mouths. Neither of us have any right to judge their decisions or decide that Yoshiki doesn't respect Toshi because he wasn't included in a single song. You are fully imagining your own thoughts into this whole thing. You have no idea how Toshi feels or how their freindship is. None of us do. Based on a single sentence on on insta video, you are making full-blown stories of what happened, when you actually have no idea what really happened. Please stop the war mongering.



Offline Matthias

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Reply #21 on: July 23, 2018, 05:42:59 PM
Song sounds okay, nothing special (neither in a good nor bad way).



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Reply #22 on: July 23, 2018, 11:44:58 PM
From Sasasama: It's really hard for me to understand Yoshiki, like for real.... but I only wrote down the things I was sure in. this is what I wrote. he says these in the first 10 minutes or so


Yoshiki:  These days were so hectic, I didn’t have time to sit down, and talk slowly. I know everyone is curious about Attack on Titan’s opening.  This is actually gonna be the first time I’m explaining this personally. First of all, the song is still in progress. I’ve been always like that *laughs*. Probably everyone, including the Attack on Titan production team is waiting for my release.  But I was seriously so busy. I’ve been getting busier and busier. Ever since Kyouhaku Uta gassen, a lot of things happened, and it was a lot of preassure as well. The day before the dinner shows we recorded with Sugizo, Pata and Heath. Generally we don’t encounter all when we’re recording, Sugizo has been around two times before, last time was a month ago. The solo part has been recorded. That day everyone gathered together. Well, but it’s in „progress”, it should be done before the end of this month. The whole song will be done at the end of the month. The 90 sec version will be released on TV.  Today, I’m going to show you the 60 seconds version. Instagram size. First of all, it is still in „progress”, I was so busy I couldn’t tell more, but instead it went in a bad direction. I got all kind of comments. In fact, I am used to it. If someone says something bad about me, you know, I have a world-class team of lawyers, for real. (Interviewer here said, „then I should be careful about what I say „ lol)

But seriously, this is my fault. I have trouble with leading the band, and the members of X Japan who have given such a great opportunity to me.  I’m sorry. I should’ve explained everything at the beginning but I’ve been too busy to do that and it become like this. Everything is my responsibility, because I’m the leader.  First of all, how can I not go to talk to Toshi first? Of course, the first thing was to tell him. But I didn’t get an answer because of various reason. And then, we just happened to eat together with Hyde, in LA. And you know,  I’ve always wanted to do various collaborations. I ’m a fan of Attack on Titan, so I wanted to do it anyway.  Of course, with X Japan it would’ve been better, but a lot of things happened, and I didn’t think about this that deeply.

We are not trying to keep the legacy—we are trying to move forward, so our sound is going to change. I’m ready to be criticized, for example by fans saying "you should rather be this style." I’m ready for it, I’m okay with any concept of criticism-Yoshiki


Offline axlroseX

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Reply #23 on: July 24, 2018, 04:59:38 AM
He's in damage control mode. What he said makes zero sense

Its not fan speculation, Toshi clearly wasnt consulted and is upset. That alone makes this a mess as it shows Yoshiki didnt have the respect or decency to include him

No, you are speculating. Toshi never said he wasn't consulted, or that he is clearly upset. You are making judgements based on a few sentences of poilte Japanese conversation, and try to sell it as facts. The real fact is however, that we don't know shit about the real reasons or how Toshi feels or why Yoshiki made decisions, or who influenced him (if anyone), and what really went down behind the scenes. it IS purely fan speculation, and YOU are giving words into their mouths. Neither of us have any right to judge their decisions or decide that Yoshiki doesn't respect Toshi because he wasn't included in a single song. You are fully imagining your own thoughts into this whole thing. You have no idea how Toshi feels or how their freindship is. None of us do. Based on a single sentence on on insta video, you are making full-blown stories of what happened, when you actually have no idea what really happened. Please stop the war mongering.

We have statements from Toshi and Yoshiki. I wish you were likely right, but it just seems like things are pointing the other way. Yoshiki sounds like a frazzled mess and Toshi was definitely not happy. Its easy to put 2 and 2 together, here.

He also is, once again, piling on more commitments that he rarely finishes. Apparently now this isnt even the "real" version of the song and theres another version? We have a whole mythical album of material like that. In not war mongering, its just how these events are played out. You are right, I dont know the exact details, none of us do. But its clear poor decisions were made.

Also, it is disrespectful not to properly discuss an outside collaborator with your singer. If my band released a song with another guitar player and barely told me, Id be furious. That's on a much higher level for X Japan...

Oh well, its done. I hope the next X Japan related news is more positive. Hopefully something will be announced soon.

Also, I know this thread is for the actual song. Sorry to get off topic
« Last Edit: July 24, 2018, 05:08:25 AM by axlroseX »



Offline axlroseX

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Reply #24 on: July 24, 2018, 05:12:42 AM
Edit- I am happy Yoshiki seems to admit it was a bad choice and show some humility here. Good for him for having integrity



Offline Fluffy

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Reply #25 on: September 16, 2018, 08:14:07 AM
https://www.facebook.com/ForOverseasHydeist/videos/672599709793186/

Preview of the full version of Red Swan! What do you think? I actually really like it. Wasn't expecting the guitar to be in it! Toshi's voice would have been awesome on this too. Especially at the end! But hey! A new song is a good thing though!? Haven't really listened to much Hyde but like his voice.
Thanks to Acido for finding this link!
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 08:22:51 AM by Fluffy »



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Reply #26 on: September 16, 2018, 09:06:14 AM
Love love love love love love love it. Lol

Funny how we all thought Sugizo's feature would be violin but it's actually a guitar solo! And a really good one at that! Yoshiki said hide's name at that part.... I wonder what he was saying.

I also really love the key change right after the guitar solo. Gave me chills! Looooove this song. Can't wait to hear an official recording without them talking over it hahaha

Also Hyde's a cool guy. He kind of creeped me out for a couple years there but he seems more mellow rockerish instead of drug dealer pirate now so... I feel mean saying that but like... yeah, Captain Sparrow on speed is scary! Anyway, lol, his voice was perfect for this song. Toshi would sound beautiful on it as well but Hyde was better for the scratchy screaming in that key imo but I would love to hear him sing it as well.

Overall, awsome! Very happy! Will play on repeat until I can get my hands on the real deal.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 09:08:02 AM by returner »

We are not trying to keep the legacy—we are trying to move forward, so our sound is going to change. I’m ready to be criticized, for example by fans saying "you should rather be this style." I’m ready for it, I’m okay with any concept of criticism-Yoshiki


Offline Kasumi

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Reply #27 on: September 16, 2018, 11:11:03 AM

While I'm away, read this line again...


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Reply #28 on: September 16, 2018, 11:25:49 AM
Thank you! I didn't know about that

We are not trying to keep the legacy—we are trying to move forward, so our sound is going to change. I’m ready to be criticized, for example by fans saying "you should rather be this style." I’m ready for it, I’m okay with any concept of criticism-Yoshiki


Offline magucathy

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Reply #29 on: September 16, 2018, 01:49:52 PM
Just listened to the song on youtube again... I decided that I don't like the song because it almost made me fall asleep.
I think the way how Hyde sang the song with a very flat tone bored me....   ::)