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Why don't they ever play anything from Vanishing Vision?

Uncontrol · 10434

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Offline Uncontrol

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I guess, MAYBE, I'll Kill You and Give me the Pleasure might be weird to some people, but then again they play ORGASM.

I mean, I see absolutely no reason why they can't play Vanishing Love.

So, why don't they every play anything from Vanishing Vision?



Offline Hollywood

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Reply #1 on: April 21, 2008, 01:53:13 AM
I completely agree.

But as for why they don't... I guess they're just trying to distance themselves from the kind of band they started out as, sadly.  They certainly don't dress like that anymore either (unfortunately), and I guess the aggressive sound of the VV songs doesn't fit (in their opinion-- or in Yoshiki's opinion, at least) with their current image/style/whatever.

Though, yeah, Orgasm, like you said.  I guess that one got "grandfathered in" somehow.

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Offline Amethyst_Dahlia

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Reply #2 on: April 21, 2008, 04:29:46 AM
Technically, Orgasm is on the Blue Blood album. But I know it was also their first single, released back in 1985. ^^



Offline Hollywood

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Reply #3 on: April 21, 2008, 06:01:31 AM
Oh of course, Orgasm isn't on Vanishing Vision-- I just thought he was using it for comparison, as an example of an old-style song they still play.

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Offline Lucs

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Reply #4 on: April 21, 2008, 06:21:47 AM
I personally have no problem with that.

They played Sadistic Desire in 1995 though.

I have no idea why they don't play more Vanishing Vision.


Offline mC

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Reply #5 on: April 21, 2008, 06:44:45 AM
I would love for them to preform some of their older stuff too. I would like to see Voiceless Screaming played again. I don't care that Taiji composed and preformed it, IMO it would be just as good if it was preformed with Heath. X have a lot of songs that they don't preform anymore / during the X Japan era  and I found that pretty sad. Although I do agree with previous poster that it may have to do with an image thing, as they certainly have changed alot since they started out....still!!!



Offline Orbis

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Reply #6 on: April 21, 2008, 06:55:09 AM
I would pay (a lot) to hear X Japan playing "Phantom of Guilt" some time.

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Offline nage

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Reply #7 on: April 21, 2008, 07:28:35 AM
Well, if it's only about (too) agressive sound... They coul play Alive......? I don't think Alive is too agressive....  :)


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Offline Uncontrol

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Reply #8 on: April 21, 2008, 07:53:43 AM
Maybe this is also why Vanishing Vision hasn't been remastered yet :(



Offline ferret

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Reply #9 on: April 21, 2008, 10:20:42 AM
As much as I love Vanishing Vison songs, I cringed every time they played Sadistic Desire with Heath picking through the slapping parts, so I'm kind of thankful they never attempted, let's say, Give Me The Pleasure, post Taiji.

Many bands don't play very early songs because they personally don't agree with those lyrics/the style anymore.

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Offline Belle & Sebastian

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Reply #10 on: April 21, 2008, 10:59:04 AM
they played lots of vv stuff during one of the on the verge of destruction concerts



Offline Maya

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Reply #11 on: April 21, 2008, 11:40:22 AM
Quote from: "le.pilote"
they played lots of vv stuff during one of the on the verge of destruction concerts


Yeah, true ... but this also has been loooong ago xD; (More than 15 years have passed since then ...)

I would die, if they played I'll kill you, Alive or whatever in Paris ;_; But I know, this won't happen. But I'm not quite sure anyhow how Toshi would sing those nowadays e__e;; For i'll kill you ... euh ... would sound strange. I guess.

But they could play Endless Dream *______*
Well, the imagination is great xD ... *sigh*

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Offline TG

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Reply #12 on: April 21, 2008, 12:05:00 PM
Yeah i agree that they should play some material off Vanishing Vision. I really enjoyed Kyoto sports valley as they played basically everything off it and Alive live was just great! However i don't think they will play any songs of it in the future..unfortunatly.

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Offline VioletCamicat

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Reply #13 on: April 21, 2008, 01:52:46 PM

Does "composed" mean music and lyrics automatically? Not sure about that, I didn't think that it was expressed the wrong way.

Quote from: mC
I would like to see Voiceless Screaming played again. I don't care that Taiji composed and preformed it, IMO it would be just as good if it was preformed with Heath.
And I WOULD care if they'd perform Voiceless Screaming without Taiji. Same goes for Desperate Angel. As much as I love those songs and would like to hear them live - I wouldn't want to hear them without Taiji. Voiceless Screaming must be with him on guitar. (I'd be really peeved, hearing it without Taiji - seriously!!! :lol: Might be silly, but that's how I feel!)
I think that those songs aren't performed by X Japan, but were indeed played by Taiji with another project and that Taiji even did a remake of Voiceless Screaming with D.T.R (with different lyrics then) shows clearly, that there must be a reason that the songs aren't performed by X Japan. I'd assume that Taiji has the rights reserved or something, but don't quote me on that, because I can only guess.

As for older songs in general I gotta agree. I'd like to hear more Blue Blood and Vanishing Vision stuff, but that's just a matter of taste. Not every band can do it like KISS and go on performing the old songs (and in KISS' case the more successful songs :P) again and again and nearly ignore the later works. I think it's kind of logical that X Japan rather play newer stuff. They simply developed a lot from the beginning on till now. I guess it could be kind of weird seeing them perform the older works like I'll Kill You and Easy Fight Rambling. :? Of course I'd be really fine with it still, but in my opinion it would seem less matching nowadays.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 05:54:44 PM by Maverick »

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Offline Maya

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Reply #14 on: April 21, 2008, 02:04:46 PM
Quote from: "VioletCamicat"
I guess it could be kind of weird seeing them perform the older works like I'll Kill You and Easy Fight Rambling. :?


I can't even imagine Toshi singing I'll Kill You ... °____°
The imagination nearly makes me laugh. XD Can anyone imagine this? With his voice nowadays? (Oh, this agression!!! Sorry, but ... xD ... euh ... *thinks of his solo stuff which makes it even more ridiculous* XD)

~ Oh, yeah, I wrote something different before, but ... if I really try to imagine ....... XD ... noooo!~

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Offline Sirimono

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Reply #15 on: April 21, 2008, 02:28:01 PM
I think there are a few reasons.
For example is one big reason that Taiji's not in the band anymore (or hide now). I'm not saying that Heath couldn't play them (even though he's not the slap and tap master himself), but it's just a matter of taste.
hide and Taiji were both for the rocky songs. I guess it's pretty much only Yoshiki and his ballads and a few classics now.

I guess you can see quite well in their development how the interest changed from rock towards melodic... melody music(?). Deciding over what is played on a concert goes through the same progress as what do we want to record now.
To both the answer would be new style X Japan. So they leave it behind.
Actually many many bands do that, sadly.

Another band which is successful with playing songs from all style periods is metallica. I wish X Japan would be more like that since i prefer the old stuff >_>

It's just stupid not to play something because you're embarrassed about it 15 years later



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Offline Hurley

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Reply #16 on: April 21, 2008, 02:34:13 PM
Quote from: "Sirimono"
It's just stupid not to play something because you're embarrassed about it 15 years later

I wouldn't play anything I'd be embarassed about. But is there anything to be embarrased about? I think not. I do admit that I can't imagine Toshi singing songs like Stab Me In The Back or I'll Kill You anymore, but I would LOVE to see him sing songs like Vanishing Love, Blue Blood, Rose of Pain etc. I think those would still fit X Japan.

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Offline Maya

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Reply #17 on: April 21, 2008, 02:45:49 PM
I personally don't think that his voice has still the ... "character" for such songs. Of course, he can sing this, it's not a matter of range. But not every voice fits every song, that's a fact. Me singing Orgasm would sound ridiculous as well xD
Ok, after all it's Toshi, he sang the song originally, that's true XD ... So the comparision sucks. BUT his voice changed a lot over the years and that's what I wanted to express (with the help of his solo stuff as well ;D not because the music is different, this has nothing to do with it of course, but his vocal style has developed and you can hear this).

I just don't think his voice can really express the original feeling of the song. His clear voice wouldn't match this hard song in my opinion e,e;
*shrug*
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 05:55:19 PM by Maverick »

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Offline ferret

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Reply #18 on: April 21, 2008, 03:18:30 PM
Quote from: "PanthereNoire"
and to call Voiceless Screaming anything but a ballad would be ridiculous to me.


Prepare to deal with many ridiculous people (including me) who think that not every love song is a ballad, and Voiceless Screaming is one of those songs.

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Offline Sirimono

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Reply #19 on: April 21, 2008, 03:18:46 PM
most of the rocky songs are by hide

and I don't know about Yoshiki being embarrassed but it's really obvious that he's not doing such music at all with any of his projects.
Another thing is our peace loving Toshi, i don't know if he'd really want to sing such songs anymore, but well... I don't really think he's that tightassed either
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 05:56:10 PM by Maverick »



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Offline AsukaMiyu

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Reply #20 on: April 21, 2008, 03:44:49 PM
Quote from: "Sirimono"
most of the rocky songs are by hide


Eeh, is that so? *starts counting...*
So I've got 11 rockish songs from Yoshiki and 7 from hide of which 3 he wrot together with somone else.
So much about that....

*wanders off*

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Offline ferret

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Reply #21 on: April 21, 2008, 03:50:29 PM
This is getting hilarious, really. The next person please find out how the mistake count is: Pata vs. hide. hide would probably win by number, no?

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Offline Sirimono

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Reply #22 on: April 21, 2008, 04:08:29 PM
I think asuka pointed it out quite well... i don't think they're 28 rocky songs though o_O;; I think 7 of 28 rocky songs is quite something (and i count most songs by x that are longer than 5 minutes as rocky anymore)

Yeah actually we have two lame ass softies in X, not that i'd mind that and I never thought Yoshiki was into war, raping kids and music pirateing

I don't think the age got much to do with it. Since especially men within the 40's tend to fall back into their youth behaviour. I mean Yoshiki started make-up again and lets his hair grow!!!

I think it's plainly that the old songs don't fit yoshiki's gay porn star producer image anymore.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 05:57:14 PM by Maverick »



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Offline Amethyst_Dahlia

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Reply #23 on: April 21, 2008, 04:15:09 PM
Ack, that's right! XD" I'm sorry! @_@
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 05:57:27 PM by Maverick »



Offline AsukaMiyu

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Reply #24 on: April 21, 2008, 04:20:15 PM
Quote from: "Sirimono"
I think asuka pointed it out quite well... i don't think they're 28 rocky songs though o_O;; I think 7 of 28 rocky songs is quite something (and i count most songs by x that are longer than 5 minutes as rocky anymore)


Aaaahm I said Yoshiki wrote 11 rock songs and hide 7. o_O;;;;;
There are some more from Taiji for example, though.

Quote from: "Sirimono"
I don't think the age got much to do with it. Since especially men within the 40's tend to fall back into their youth behaviour. I mean Yoshiki started make-up again and lets his hair grow!!!

I think it's plainly that the old songs don't fit yoshiki's gay porn star producer image anymore.

He never stopped wearing makeup, except for his classical appearances. He wore makeup for all his solo and VUK photoshoots though? o_O He's just back with his belovd band so he got a reason to wear make-up more often again.....

and WTF gay porn star producer image!???????? O_O;;;;

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Offline Hollywood

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Reply #25 on: April 21, 2008, 06:02:27 PM
It's a shame to see a decent discussion degenerate into personal insults, but anyway...

Quote from: VioletCamicat
And I WOULD care if they'd perform Voiceless Screaming without Taiji. Same goes for Desperate Angel. As much as I love those songs and would like to hear them live - I wouldn't want to hear them without Taiji. Voiceless Screaming must be with him on guitar. (I'd be really peeved, hearing it without Taiji - seriously!!! :lol: Might be silly, but that's how I feel!)
Totally agree!  I don't think it's silly, either-- those songs were very specifically Taiji, and I suspect the band feels the same way (even aside of the possible rights issues).  To me playing those without Taiji would be like playing White Wind from Mr. Martin without Pata.  (I don't think they've ever played that live anyway, but just as an example.)

And I too am glad-- I think ferret was the first one who said it-- that they didn't attempt any of Taiji's pop/slap stuff with Heath.  Asking Heath to copy Taiji's style and play songs that were (and are) heavily associated with Taiji isn't even all that respectful to Heath as musician, frankly.  Heath should be allowed to have his own style, not expected to become some kind of Taiji impersonator.

But at any rate, yeah, I too wish they played more of the old stuff.  Doubt they will, though, since the band took such a radically different direction after 1992 or so.  Too bad.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 05:58:02 PM by Maverick »

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Offline Uncontrol

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Reply #26 on: April 21, 2008, 09:57:48 PM
Meh. This topic is depressing me. <_<

I think them not playing their harder songs has more to do with what the majority of their fans expect out of them. People want to hear more Forever Love and less I'll Kill You. Songs like Forever Love is what rakes in the money, i guess.

It's like the more I think about it, the more and more Yoshiki looks like a dick. :(



Offline Hurley

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Reply #27 on: April 21, 2008, 10:09:29 PM
Quote from: "Uncontrol"
Meh. This topic is depressing me. <_<

I think them not playing their harder songs has more to do with what the majority of their fans expect out of them. People want to hear more Forever Love and less I'll Kill You. Songs like Forever Love is what rakes in the money, i guess.

It's like the more I think about it, the more and more Yoshiki looks like a dick. :(

Well, if the majority of fans want to hear Forever Love instead of I'll Kill You, playing it will make him some money AND make the majority of fans happy. So he should make the majority of his fans unhappy and make less money to look more like a Yoshiki and less like a penis? ;P

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Offline Anna

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Reply #28 on: April 21, 2008, 10:13:52 PM
Quote

Well, if the majority of fans want to hear Forever Love instead of I'll Kill You, playing it will make him some money AND make the majority of fans happy. So he should make the majority of his fans unhappy and make less money to look more like a Yoshiki and less like a penis? ;P


 :D  And count me in as a majority. I love that song.

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Offline Maya

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Reply #29 on: April 21, 2008, 10:14:46 PM
Quote from: "Hurley"
So he should make the majority of his fans unhappy and make less money to look more like a Yoshiki and less like a penis? ;P


This made me laugh. XD

Well ... I agree here ;3

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